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Coronavirus

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Problem is powerful families, groups who primarily run the world are not in the public eye. It's not so much a conspiracy as how the world and societies developed. They run things through supporting, funding, developing various systems and organizations and putting barriers in place of those who are problematic for them. This is my impression from watching world events, paying attention to certain historians and analysts etc..

That's my answer to the question why anybody would like to hurt the economy and hurt millions of people, I'm pretty confident there are people that would. I know my notion of "unknown powerful people" seems weird , cause that's not something commonly discussed, but whatever. I don't find it likely that pr buffoons like our politicians, are actually allowed to run the world and make important independent decisions.

In terms of what I like to listen to news wise, I prefer independent journalists like Grayzone, Abby Martin,Chris Hedges etc.. anti-imperialists. Anyone I feel sounds interesting and reasonable. But I can't say I listened to anyone opposed to shutdowns, that was my own impression
 
Vegas Dave
Same question I just asked reno. Since the liberal media is panic peddling bullshit, where should I be getting my news? How do I become enlightened?
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I avoid Fox News like the plague.

I’ve never claimed to have the answers.

I’ve only given my opinions (which I assume are welcomed on a democratic forum) as a 40-something who’s been around the block and watched the news whip everyone into a panic about hurricanes, Ebola, the swine flu, Isis, YOU NAME IT, only to have ultimately seen it blown way out of proportion time after time.
 
just heard somebody bring up a good point. I'd like to see how the mortality rate, especially in places like Italy compares with other years? Since all positive cases deaths are attributed to the disease, (if the virus is widespread) that would include considerable amount of people who'd die anyway :hmm:
 
Tron
I avoid Fox News like the plague.

I’ve never claimed to have the answers.

I’ve only given my opinions (which I assume are welcomed on a democratic forum) as a 40-something who’s been around the block and watched the news whip everyone into a panic about hurricanes, Ebola, the swine flu, Isis, YOU NAME IT, only to have ultimately seen it blown way out of proportion time after time.
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Yes, you are absolutely entitled to your opinions!

You still didn't answer my question though. If you avoid Fox News like the plague, and CNN is panic-peddling nonsense, how do you stay informed? What news sources or scientific journals are you staying educated on the virus with that aren't tainted by agenda?

Or are you formulating your opinions purely on your own observations/"feel" and your mistrust of the media?
 
Vegas Dave
Same question I just asked reno. Since the liberal media is panic peddling bullshit, where should I be getting my news? How do I become enlightened?
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Dave, with the quarantine in full effect for me, I stopped watching all news. Deactivated all social media. I’ll catch cliff notes of updates once a day. The way I see it, what else are we supposed to do at this point? I don’t see the benefit from keeping track of stats and death tolls daily. It just causes anxiety.

Ozark’s new season is now on Netflix. That’s all the day holds.
 
Casperwaits
Dave, with the quarantine in full effect for me, I stopped watching all news. Deactivated all social media. I’ll catch cliff notes of updates once a day. The way I see it, what else are we supposed to do at this point? I don’t see the benefit from keeping track of stats and death tolls daily. It just causes anxiety.

Ozark’s new season is now on Netflix. That’s all the day holds.
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I have no problem with this... like you said, not much we can do.

You also haven't called this virus a glorified flu and stated the media is causing an unwarranted panic repeatedly, as Tron has.

I just want to know what his process is. I don't watch cable news either... it's sensationalist trash. But I DO read newspaper articles and CNN articles for information. I try to keep a critical mind and take everything with a grain of salt. And even with this grain of salt and agreeing that TV news sucks, I still haven't seen anything from any reputable sources that suggests we should be taking this lightly, that this is "just a flu", or that ending social distancing early wouldn't be a catastrophic mistake.

So in the interest of keeping an open mind, I'm just trying to see if I'm missing something here. If Tron is just taking guesses (all past pandemics have turned out not to be a big deal, so this isn't either), that's his prerogative... but I'll just go ahead and stay on the side of medical experts. But if he actually has some news sources or med journals I'm not privy to, I'd love to read them to expand my understanding of what's going on.
 
Vegas Dave
If you avoid Fox News like the plague, and CNN is panic-peddling nonsense, how do you stay informed? What news sources or scientific journals are you staying educated on the virus with that aren't tainted by agenda?

Or are you formulating your opinions purely on your own observations/"feel" and your mistrust of the media?
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It’s a combination of both.

You may discount my own observations and feel but I don’t. I’ve watched news broadcasters and some on social media explode with fear mongering countless times for clicks/likes and advertising dollars.

I listen to to the World Health Organization who and I quote “estimates that seasonal flu may result in 290,000-650,000 deaths each year due to respiratory diseases alone”.

www.who.int

Burden of disease

Influenza burden of disease (BoD)
www.who.int www.who.int



I also follow David Friedberg on Twitter for non-hysterical COVID-19 news.

I’d like to add that I never called this virus a glorified flu.

Where do you get your information from, Dave?
 
What's fuckin w my head (besides worrying about people I care about, especially my parents) is seeing famous people die.

That cook. He didn't look too old too me.

Playwright Terrence McNally - sure old, but still.

Fuckin Magic Johnson has HIV and he has for 20 years. They're supposed to live through just about anything.

I see them go and I'm like wow what does that say for the common folk, who can't buy the best meds/treatment in the world.
 
We did a 3 week trip in Spain and Portugal in the fall. That's what is fuckin with my mind right now. Weird to see them struggle so bad, and also relieved that we originally were going to make that a spring trip.
 
Tron
It’s a combination of both.

You may discount my own observations and feel but I don’t. I’ve watched news broadcasters and some on social media explode with fear mongering countless times for clicks/likes and advertising dollars.

I listen to to the World Health Organization who and I quote “estimates that seasonal flu may result in 290,000-650,000 deaths each year due to respiratory diseases alone”.

www.who.int

Burden of disease

Influenza burden of disease (BoD)
www.who.int www.who.int

I also follow David Friedberg on Twitter for non-hysterical COVID-19 news.

I’d like to add that I never called this virus a glorified flu.

Where do you get your information from, Dave?
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Thanks for the response. You are right, you never called it a glorified flu... I just drew this conclusion from your multiple references to the flu in this thread. Among them, you told me that I should be just as worried about my parents dying of the flu as this. You also said "Are we gonna shut the world down next year for the seasonal flu?"... Were these comments not meant to insinuate that this isn't much worse than the flu?

Have been keeping up with the CDC for this. Generally read CNN.com and the Washington Post, but also pretty frequently use Google News and read articles from reputable news outlets (like major newspapers, BBC, Reuters, etc).
 
I am concerned about how poorly some people in my state are practicing Social Distancing.

On a solo bike ride yesterday, I saw a 11 on 11 soccer game going on at a city park. I saw a bunch of people at an outdoor bar/restaurant sitting very close to each other. Bars aren’t even supposed to be open for 30 days

It is Florida so I shouldn’t be surprised that people are not complying.

My own personal silver lining in all of this is that it has gotten my back on my bike after taking 10 months off after my crash.

I’m not riding exciting trails like I used to but I’ve been doing 10-12 miles on the street 6 days a week.

I’m going to reactivate my Fit Food Fresh meal delivery service today. I’m running out of food to eat and don’t want to go out for food anymore.

I also have the sensation of shortness of breath but no other symptoms. And I’ve felt ok on my bike rides. Probably just some anxiety.
 
Tron
I am concerned about how poorly some people in my state are practicing Social Distancing.

On a solo bike ride yesterday, I saw a 11 on 11 soccer game going on at a city park. I saw a bunch of people at an outdoor bar/restaurant sitting very close to each other. Bars aren’t even supposed to be open for 30 days

It is Florida so I shouldn’t be surprised that people are not complying.

My own personal silver lining in all of this is that it has gotten my back on my bike after taking 10 months off after my crash.

I’m not riding exciting trails like I used to but I’ve been doing 10-12 miles on the street 6 days a week.

I’m going to reactivate my Fit Food Fresh meal delivery service today. I’m running out of food to eat and don’t want to go out for food anymore.

I also have the sensation of shortness of breath but no other symptoms. And I’ve felt ok on my bike rides. Probably just some anxiety.
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yeah in Chicago we got a major scolding from our Mayor and Faux Police chief. They had to shut down our lake front trails, parks, and other high traffic trails.

I've been going out for 5-6 dog walks a day. I don't see too many people at all. The 7am one is sometimes as long as an hr and 45 mins. Walked halfway to downtown and back yesterday and I saw about 12 people the entire time.

Were you doing mountain biking before on rough trails? What kind of bike/s do you have?
 
Tron
I am concerned about how poorly some people in my state are practicing Social Distancing.

On a solo bike ride yesterday, I saw a 11 on 11 soccer game going on at a city park. I saw a bunch of people at an outdoor bar/restaurant sitting very close to each other. Bars aren’t even supposed to be open for 30 days

It is Florida so I shouldn’t be surprised that people are not complying.

My own personal silver lining in all of this is that it has gotten my back on my bike after taking 10 months off after my crash.

I’m not riding exciting trails like I used to but I’ve been doing 10-12 miles on the street 6 days a week.

I’m going to reactivate my Fit Food Fresh meal delivery service today. I’m running out of food to eat and don’t want to go out for food anymore.

I also have the sensation of shortness of breath but no other symptoms. And I’ve felt ok on my bike rides. Probably just some anxiety.
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Congrats on getting back on the bike! I'm looking forward to walking again... I haven't been able to without a dry cough for the last couple of weeks and don't want to potentially spread germs with it.

It's the same in Cali. I live right across the street from a park and I've yet to see a day go by without some fools having a picnic or playing a game or whatever. Too many people don't care.

Yeah, delivery services are awesome for the quarantine. If only I could find someone who would deliver toilet paper......
 
Tron
I am concerned about how poorly some people in my state are practicing Social Distancing.

On a solo bike ride yesterday, I saw a 11 on 11 soccer game going on at a city park. I saw a bunch of people at an outdoor bar/restaurant sitting very close to each other. Bars aren’t even supposed to be open for 30 days

It is Florida so I shouldn’t be surprised that people are not complying.

My own personal silver lining in all of this is that it has gotten my back on my bike after taking 10 months off after my crash.

I’m not riding exciting trails like I used to but I’ve been doing 10-12 miles on the street 6 days a week.

I’m going to reactivate my Fit Food Fresh meal delivery service today. I’m running out of food to eat and don’t want to go out for food anymore.

I also have the sensation of shortness of breath but no other symptoms. And I’ve felt ok on my bike rides. Probably just some anxiety.
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yeah, no bars are allowed to be open. I know of people that are sitting outside of our bar and bringing their own beer and just drinking on our patio. It’s so bizarre.

I was asked to go to a girls house for a booty call today and I’m not going to go. Seems like the risk is not worth the reward. If you aren’t going out for essentials, you can get a ticket.
 
Vegas Dave
Thanks for the response. You are right, you never called it a glorified flu... I just drew this conclusion from your multiple references to the flu in this thread. Among them, you told me that I should be just as worried about my parents dying of the flu as this. You also said "Are we gonna shut the world down next year for the seasonal flu?"... Were these comments not meant to insinuate that this isn't much worse than the flu?

Have been keeping up with the CDC for this. Generally read CNN.com and the Washington Post, but also pretty frequently use Google News and read articles from reputable news outlets (like major newspapers, BBC, Reuters, etc).
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I think it's fine to read all sources, I do. But you do so to see what people are thinking, to filter whatever relevant information through other sources understanding and experience. You don't blindly accept stuff because it's from a so called, reputable source. These are the same people who pushed the ridiculous Russiagate fiasco with a straight face for years. Same people who constantly push bellicose rhetoric and aggression against other countries. To say that they don't have an agenda is laughable. It's just the way those institutions are created systematically. They are designed to promote the agenda of certain powerful forces, be it Pentagon, certain corporations, individuals etc.

Also when you talk about doctors, you should consider that it's human nature to want to elevate the significance of what you do. All of a sudden everybody's asking your opinion, and how to save the country etc. And the one who makes the scariest projections will get the biggest headline. There is no incentive to downplay a story, same with governors, media etc.
 
Up to 17% death rate with closed cases but still at 95% mild active cases! Unfortunately we can't test everyone to make the ones who have it stay isolated, and the rest go back to work! Sounds like some parts of the country will go back to work, and the hot spots will still be shut down! Hopefully we close FLA to NYC and NNJ people from staying/entering our state! Get better, then visit!
 
reno cool
I think it's fine to read all sources, I do. But you do so to see what people are thinking, to filter whatever relevant information through other sources understanding and experience. You don't blindly accept stuff because it's from a so called, reputable source. These are the same people who pushed the ridiculous Russiagate fiasco with a straight face for years. Same people who constantly push bellicose rhetoric and aggression against other countries. To say that they don't have an agenda is laughable. It's just the way those institutions are created systematically. They are designed to promote the agenda of certain powerful forces, be it Pentagon, certain corporations, individuals etc.
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Which again is where the grain of salt comes in. I mean I'm going to default to occam's razor when it comes to most things... if the vast majority of newspapers and sources are reporting an incident (let's say a bus crash with 10 killed), it's certainly POSSIBLE they are all in on a huge conspiracy and the bus crash never happened... but it's just more likely that it happened. Facts are facts. There are just too many rabbitholes to go down otherwise, and you are free to do so, but I'd rather not.

Now "takes" and "spins" and opinions are totally different things. I agree whole-heartedly that many publications have an agenda or a lean when it comes to the way that they cover something. That's where critical thinking comes in, obviously.

reno cool
Also when you talk about doctors, you should consider that it's human nature to want to elevate the significance of what you do. All of a sudden everybody's asking your opinion, and how to save the country etc. And the one who makes the scariest projections will get the biggest headline. There is no incentive to downplay a story, same with governors, media etc.
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So I'm with you that there's delusions of grandeur, that human beings are inherently flawed and might exaggerate, etc. But again it just takes too big of a leap of faith to assume that every single doctor/scientist/etc is scheming up this fabrication... when it's more likely they are just telling (mostly) the truth. Even if we leave a little room for error and exaggeration, there is still a great deal of consensus on these matters.

There's being a skeptic and then there's simply not believing anything anyone says except for things that support your own viewpoints. I mean if someone writes off everything that they disagree with (however based in fact it is) as "fake news" and then just stays in their bubble of bullshit, that's certainly their right... but that doesn't make them correct.

But this is why as an atheist I can't disprove God, because the theist can always just say "God made it that way". Alright then, conversation over. When you hypothesize not only about these powerful forces behind closed doors but that you also know which strings they are pulling, what can be believed and what is bullshit, and the only compass to this is in your head... I can't really agree or disagree. There's no equal grounds there.
 
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