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california here i come

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Teela
In reality, ANYONE can get a degree. It doesn't matter how brilliant or how much of an idiot the person is. I just have issues that someone isn't worth as much or their contributions to society are worth less because of a lack of a degree.
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A degree is essentially worthless unless you use it, which 98.6% of individuals with degrees do NOT do.
 
Education level is coralated with many things. Life span, amount of children, traditional levels of success ($), and yes even intellect (iq). While I might agree that some of these measures are misguided or even simply wrong, to ignore them would besilly.

I agree that the net benefit from each $ spent on education is prob less at progressively higher levels of education. Put surely as a class of people (not individual instances) masters graduates have a higher intellect than high school dropouts.
 
I've always thought that unless you "become" something as a result of your education, then anyone can take any subject matter just to get the piece of paper and it makes no difference. Some people become teachers, accountants, social workers (at least where I was from), lawyers, psychs, etc... once they graduate. Those are people who need to obtain a degree as you can't operate in their chosen fields without one.

But for the rest of us, if we're lucky we learned some self-discipline by not having a teacher there to call your parents if you didn't show up to school, made some great friends and contacts, encountered other points of view that our sheltered worlds may not have provided before. That's just life stuff though that I could've obtained from just living in the real world. Not anything that was useful to my career.

On the other hand, without my Masters I 99.9% had no chance of getting the job I currently have although it's in a completely unrelated field to what I studied. It's a snotty industry with too many people trying to get in so that's one thing they use to auto exclude people for certain positions. I'd be curious to know where I'd have ended up without that post grad degree. Probably just as happy to be honest.
 
Boner_18
Education level is coralated with many things. Life span, amount of children, traditional levels of success ($), and yes even intellect (iq). While I might agree that some of these measures are misguided or even simply wrong, to ignore them would besilly.

I agree that the net benefit from each $ spent on education is prob less at progressively higher levels of education. Put surely as a class of people (not individual instances) masters graduates have a higher intellect than high school dropouts.
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I completely disagree. We're not simply talking high school dropouts.

More education can be, in some cases, correlated with a higher income. However, this is not ALWAYS the case. A higher income doesn't make a person smarter or more worthwhile. A higher level of education also does not make a person smarter. There are plenty of BRILLIANT people that do not have either college degrees or a higher degree above a bachelor's degree.

Original point: Worth of person and intellect is not based on the level of education.
 
Of course masters/phd grads are more intellectual than a high school dropout (on average). No one is debating that. However, do you consider the 40-year-old who got his MBA from University of Phoenix to have a higher level of intelligence than the homeless drunk sleeping under a bridge?
 
HotBuns, intellect can be subjective.
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CaliGirlNJ
please feel free to pull your own facts and show me that the college you graduated from (how many years back???) is better than the one i graduated from. You will find that it is comparing apples to oranges. Besides different schools within the universities have different admission policies etc.

oh and by the way I'm talking about GRADUATE SCHOOL, not undergrad. Do you have your masters?
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If you really want him to do a side by side of his alma mater and your alma mater, why don't you tell him where you completed your undergrad so it can be an accurate comparison?
 
Teela
I completely disagree. We're not simply talking high school dropouts.

More education can be, in some cases, correlated with a higher income. However, this is not ALWAYS the case. A higher income doesn't make a person smarter or more worthwhile. A higher level of education also does not make a person smarter. There are plenty of BRILLIANT people that do not have either college degrees or a higher degree above a bachelor's degree.

Original point: Worth of person and intellect is not based on the level of education.
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While I agree with your theories I will play devils advocate here to stir up the pot.

Of course there is always an outlier to any trend. Making that point doesn't help justify your argument though. We need to define what a persons worth is and contains?

Also from a large company perspective of 50k people that need to hire 10k people for growth in a year and see 100k in apps how would you go about filtering down to the best candidates with a pile of resumes? Would you interview all 100k people and spend 100k hours in a room with each one? It's not cost effective.
 
Its something like 30% now of students who get their undergrad degree without doing anything at all; 8% of grad students and around 2-3% of phd students (who generally keep the same person who did their masters). Thats just the % of those who do absolutely nothing at all. For those who "cheat" in some instance or another, its around 85% of undergrads, 60% of grads, and 15% of PHD students.
 
FreeFall
While I agree with your theories I will play devils advocate here to stir up the pot.

Of course there is always an outlier to any trend. Making that point doesn't help justify your argument though. We need to define what a persons worth is and contains?

Also from a large company perspective of 50k people that need to hire 10k people for growth in a year and see 100k in apps how would you go about filtering down to the best candidates with a pile of resumes? Would you interview all 100k people and spend 100k hours in a room with each one? It's not cost effective.
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Surely they would spend time looking them up on facebook and finding the ones they could fuck and/or sexually harass.....that part is easy
 
30%? Nothing at all??????????


at least ya gotta PAY to play.... a get in the diploma club....

I'd love to see some references and credits to where these %'s come from...

Some of the most Brilliant and largest contributors to society in the way of Inventions, Ideas, Politics, Business, Industry, economy ect had very little education

but gotta look at both sides of the coin when making exception to the rule type statements...

I do think alot less HS kids should be going to or preparing for college... But I don't really know what else they will all be doing in the 21st century US economy

I gots more questions than answers... that much is for sure
 
HotBuns
Of course masters/phd grads are more intellectual than a high school dropout (on average). No one is debating that. However, do you consider the 40-year-old who got his MBA from University of Phoenix to have a higher level of intelligence than the homeless drunk sleeping under a bridge?
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Teela I agree on your original point, particularly as it pertains worth (and as an aside happyness).

On this hotbuns, taking that scenario 1,000,000 times and measuring intelect by traditional means I would bet even money on the MBA everytime. You'd be a fool (or a drunk homeless person) not to. WWelcome to gl btw.
 
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